[SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

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[SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by DarkyBenji »

Hey everybody, today is the day to learn NEW thing about SA2B AGAIN (unless you already know :blink: )

long time ago i've been looking the model in the DLL file and found some model that i didn't know that was there, i even made a topic about it : viewtopic.php?f=32&t=46453

welp now i found out that sonic2app.exe have model on it too ! So i got check and look into ALL the chao model and... yup i got the garden plant, the animal part, and some decoration from kindergarten, that was cute :herosway:
but i'm not here to say just that

indeed there some surprise i found when i was looking to the model in Sonic2app.exe, and yep there alot of unused model for chao world

so i'm gonna post the model here and see what you guys thing, i'm gonna name some object like *OBJECT TITLE that sonic2app.exe give them (with the picture of course)

btw for chao world extended player, yes i'm gonna also say if i can bring it back or not

BIG Medal
ImageImageImageImageImage
I'm not gonna show all the medal, you know how they look
so yeah, aparently the bigger medal are supposed to appear in chao world
maybe in kindergarten ? maybe a collection room where you look the medal you got ?
are we supposed to look 3D medal in doctor chao ?

also the model are finished, but for unknow reason, it divised on 3 for some jewel, and i just show 1 model than 3, so that explain why you have "missing polygons" for some of them (and i'm not gonna show the same medal 3 times)

Can i bring it back ? NO
for now, i have not idea how i can bring them back


Raccoon Tail
ImageImage
i KNEW something was missing when i was giving my raccoon to my chao.. the Tail of course !
Yup for unknow reason, Sega made the raccoon tail model but never add it to the game...
i'm not sure if raccoon tail appear in DC version

but hey ! that's actually a tanooki chao :chaohappy: so cute

Can i bring it back ? Yes, but...
i have to replace one of the animal tail used in the game


TOY : BOAT
Image
that's actually a duck... but yeah, i don't know what this toy do, except float on the water and that's it
do we have a chao animation special for this duck ? idk i have to check

there's not model prize for this toy which mean you don't get this toys in chao race, maybe from the GBA ?
maybe, i remember when i wanted my duck in my tiny chao garden and put in GC when i was little
guess sega/sonic team planned to do that but didn't finish :no:

Can i bring it back ? I Don't know
do i have to replace a toy by this ? i don't know if chao can climb on it
i have to search more about this toy


TOY : HANABI (Firecrackers)
ImageImage
aw geez what do we have here ?... it's not too dangerous for chao ?
if i understand the name and the model we have a bomb and... something that shoot firework ?
i can't use this toy, i can only see it, funny thing is, the Unknow (glitch toy?) from fusion chao editor is actually a action for the toy HANABI, the tiny stick that the chao hold was actually for those toys

there's not model prize for this toy which mean you don't get this toys in chao race

Can i bring it back ? NO
i don't feel i can bring it this toy back
but i would still try anyway and crash because i'm a idiot :omochao:


TOY : Kanoke (Coffin)
ImageImage
now sega, what is this ? is this really for chao ?! i don't know, for the game, IT'S a toy !
i have not idea what this do, if you guys know, please tell me
i didn't even found a chao animation for that !

there's not model prize for this toy which mean you don't get this toys in chao race

Can i bring it back ? i Don't know
maybe for decoration only


TOY : Organ
ImageImage
this toy is.. broken, i have not idea how to fix the problem with textures (i even tried without the tubes)
there even a chao animation for this toy, and a sound effect

Image
this is actually a toy prize of chao race ! maybe the 3rd toy of dark garden ?

on action :
Image

Can i bring it back ?Yes, but no
i would like to fix the "visual" problem first, i'm not gonna add this back if it's not fixed


TOY : Piano
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this toy look great, seems to work great, and have not problem at all compared to the organ

Image
this is actually a toy prize of chao race ! maybe the 3rd toy of hero garden ?

on action :
Image

Can i bring it back ? YES
i actually did it :
Spoiler:
Image

TOY : Rattle Dark & Hero
ImageImage
aparently, the dark and hero are supposed to have a different Rattle version
how do i know they are rattle ? well the game just tell me

ImageImage
there even a prize model for both of them ! now i wonder if Hero&Dark Race was supposed to give 1 toy per race

Can i bring it back ?YES
i just did :3


TOY : Ukiwa (Float)
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erm... i don't know how to use it, but this toy should help chao to swim
the problem is how i'm gonna put that in a chao...

there's not model prize for this toy which mean you don't get this toys in chao race

Can i bring it back ?NO
i need to search more


and that's it ! for now...
what do you thing ? any question ? feedback would be nice :chaohappy:
Last edited by DarkyBenji on Wed Apr 13, 2016 1:03 am, edited 9 times in total.
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by chaoadventures »

There's an inner tube and a duck boat. Hm. They both seem like they're made to help chao that can't swim and not just decoration, like the GBA duck.

So, maybe you were supposed to buy them from the Black Market for the gardens? They look like they'd be a recommended purchase for the gardens.
Maybe a prize for finishing all of the races in a set of them (Like completing all of the Jewel Races.) and wouldn't show up after your chao wins the race but just appears in the gardens?
I can't think of anything else.

It definitely seems like some of these were more finished than others. I'm surprised there's so many unfinished chao things in the game though.

The Playground, the Library, animations and behaviors, and even a bunch of mostly incomplete toys.
I feel like there should be a page on the main site for all of these unused things, since there's just so many of them.

Regardless, it's great to see all of these things uncovered.
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by Mamkute »

These are all really cool, and it is interesting to see that there were possibly more things planned for Hero and Dark Chao race rewards than just the horse, boombox and balls, since it could balance out more compared to the amount of things in the neutral garden.
Also, in the GBA games I thought the duck didn't actually do anything. Or at least, I couldn't get it to be useful.

Also, what is the deal with the coffin? That is pretty dark.
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by chaoadventures »

Yeah, the Tiny Chao Garden duck doesn't do anything other than float in the water. It's just decoration. (As far as we can tell).
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by Ivogoji »

I dunno, coffins seem like an appropriate addition to the Dark Garden.

Teach Chao to play dead.
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by Speeps »

If it's worth anything, the Dreamcast version (at least, it's probably in SA2B too) has this item list mentioning a few of those. I know I've seen the textures for a few of those toys in the Dreamcast version's files, so they're probably in there too.
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by DarkyBenji »

JmTsHaW wrote:If it's worth anything, the Dreamcast version (at least, it's probably in SA2B too) has this item list mentioning a few of those. I know I've seen the textures for a few of those toys in the Dreamcast version's files, so they're probably in there too.
oh thx, i'm gonna add the names in some unused toy,
also Firecrackers ? well this is more interesting, i kinda want to search more information about this toy now
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by Goat »

I'd wager good money that the coffin was meant to be a bed for chao
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by Sable »

JmT and I actually found the organ textures in the Dreamcast version a couple of days ago while mining for unused content from SA2: The Trial, so it's cool that you found the model as well.

EDIT: didn't notice he mentioned that beforehand oops
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by Pufflehugs »

Wait, aren't animal parts stored as seperate variables per part type? Wouldn't setting the tail variable to raccoon force that to come up? Or at least do something?
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by chaoadventures »

I'm guessing if the value for "Tail" is changed to "Raccoon" the game isn't set to load the tail in the first place, so nothing happens. Or it crashes. I don't know. I don't even know if that's how it loads the parts.
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by Pufflehugs »

Me neither. Making a variable just makes the most sense to me (I program quite a bit as a hobby, and that is what I would do.).
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by arkhamtheknight »

The big medal probably wan't used because the Chao are too small for it so they added smaller medals instead.
The Raccoon tail looks cool and was probably cut out at last minute to get the game out quicker or animation issues with other chao too close.
The boat was probably a prize but for some final race or hidden one. Most likely for Chao to go around in. That should of been in the game.
The hanabi clearly was almost complete but who knows why they cut it out. Maybe too much like a bomb look? Or just laziness.
The coffin would clearly be for Dark Chao Garden, either a bed or a weird toy? Could also be for transformation originally?
Organ and Piano are clearly for Hero and Dark Gardens, best bet is prizes for Dark/Hero Races. The visual effect just needs changing then could be tested to see what use it has fully. Would it need to replace a toy though? Also I would like to see what it looks like in-game.
I was wondering about the rattles as 1 rattle would be odd for all gardens.
The float was probably a Market item, maybe Downloadable at one time to help people who couldn't teach the chao to swim? It would be useful for the races and improve swim stat. But maybe too easy advantage for the game.
:herosway:
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by DarkyBenji »

alright, after alot of search, i make some unused toy work !
some of them are still need work, please note that sega just did the model and texture, but didn't program the unused toy, so i did all by myself

anyway let's see how far i did :

ImageImage
duck toy on action, kinda work like the horse, except it moving (weirdly) in the water, i need to work more so the duck move.. better

Image
organ textures are finally fixed ! now it look better and not broken at all !
i can finally bring this back if i can

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for the coffin, this is how it look closed
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and this is how it look open
the chao fit perfectly, i guess this toy is used to sleep on it (some of you guys already say that, and it kinda correct i can't see the other point of this)

and if you didn't notice, i put a gif of my chao play piano and organ (organ before it was fixed)

oh and btw, if you didn't notice i actually added a toy in dark garden, you can kinda see in the coffin screenshot,
i have to remove a object to make it possible.. and i choose a seed tree placement so now i can only place 3 seed tree and not 4 anymore...

(stupid game crash when i ACTUALLY add toy without remove a thing :heroangry: )
anyway i will continue later
Pufflehugs wrote:Wait, aren't animal parts stored as seperate variables per part type? Wouldn't setting the tail variable to raccoon force that to come up? Or at least do something?
the tail don't appear when you set the tail to raccoon value
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by Pufflehugs »

DarkyBenji wrote:The tail doesn't appear when you set the tail to the raccoon's value.
Huh, neat. If it is in the DC version like you speculated, I'd say Nintendo didn't approve of it due to it's similarities with Raccoon Mario, so it wasn't in their ports, and they were too lazy to add it back in to the other ports.
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by Mooncow »

DarkyBenji wrote:Yup for unknow reason, Sega made the raccoon tail model but never add it to the game...
i'm not sure if raccoon tail appear in DC version
I don't remember seeing raccoon tail in the DC version, maybe we should make a list of things we need to clarify and I can play through the dreamcast version on stream one day and check them all out!

Great finds as well guys, JmT mentioned the new items to me on SKype and then the next day ChaoGardenBuster showed me DarkyBenji adding to his mod! Crazy stuff and so exciting!!
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by Mooncow »

Also if you haven't seen... take a look at this thread in Contributions:
[SA2] All Dreamcast Chao World text

Under the title: MSGCHAOITEM_E we have Wooden horse, Piano, Coffin, Organ and more..
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by Speeps »

Oh man I forgot all about that.
Go! Kid Chao group.
Cry baby Chao race.
New challenger! Powerful golden rival.
A new challenger! Powerful sliver rival.
This is a bit off-topic but is there anything left of these races or are they completely non-existant?
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by DarkyBenji »

JmTsHaW wrote:This is a bit off-topic but is there anything left of these races or are they completely non-existant?
i don't think i see icon about these challenge in PC version (al_ent_rival_tex.prs)
but i know i saw one of unused challenge (vs Powerful sliver rival) in the text file when i was making my race mod
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by DarkyBenji »

alright, i search more, i found atleast 100 model in sonic2app.exe, not gonna show them all, but let' see what's really interesting :

VMU model
Image

yup it's seems to be a VMU but with wrong texture loaded (it's kinda creepy)

-----------------------------------------------------

Bad fruit (?)
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yeah i know you will say "how it's a unused model", i agree if you FORCE a fruit value with fusion chao editor (or cheat engine) you can load them, if you eat them you got a nice boost of swim and fly (or not), it's really weird, i don't think the stat are programmed correctly for bad fruit

how i know it's a bad fruit ? well the color seems to show that the fruit is.. spoil ?

there 2 models of the same fruit, the good one and the bad one
idk what the bad fruit really do, but by guessing, i guess they suppose to appear after age 8, and give bad stat and maybe sick chao will happen
(fruit actually have age, in the vanilla version, after 8 age they disappear)

and you can't sell the fruit...

the only fruit that can be bad are : Chaogarden fruit, herogarden fruit, darkgarden fruit, strong fruit, tasty fruit, hero fruit, dark fruit, round fruit, triangle fruit and square fruit
notice all the fruit i say have also a seed, maybe bad fruit come from the tree idk

here the screenshot :
ImageImageImageImageImage

(hero fruit, dark fruit, round fruit, triangle fruit and square fruit don't have diffrence compared to the original)

--------------------------------------------------

about the toy :

Guess people know that Boat, Coffin, Float, Piano, and Organ are the toys for the GARDEN

i feel like the gardens are supposed to have 4 toys :heroblink:
Hero garden : Horse, Ball, Piano and Float
Dark garden : Radio, Ball, Organ and Coffin
Chao Garden : TV, Box, Ball and Boat

i bring back the piano and organ :chaohappy:
but i don't think i can bring back Boat and Float, because chao never played toy on water

oh and for bonus :
Image
Image

you guys only see the object of hero garden but i'm actually in The playground !
i tried to load the playground model into hero garden to visit atleast, the model appear invisible (that's why it's all black)
but the collision are still here so i can... walk on it (i can be on the fountain)

and here some random stuff i made :
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by Crazo3077 »

Is there any hopes of the Playground being salvaged? Or is access permanently limited?
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by Sable »

on the topic of the playground, are there any more unused areas in the game? specifically i'd like to see SONIC_TEST and KNUCKLES_TEST unearthed, and jmt and i found textures corresponding to a possible fourth test level with no matching index number.
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by arkhamtheknight »

I so wanna see what the Playground looks like finished with textures complete so we know what it was gonna look like. Plus it sucks that we can't find out how well the water toys would work if they had finished it fully. And the SONIC_TEST and KNUCKLES_TEST stuff would be cool to see.
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by DarkyBenji »

The collision of playground work great
But the visual model crash the game when i try to enable it

maybe the model is wrong for steam version or maybe the texture have incorrect format
or some data is missing for correctly load the playground...

For sonic and knuckles test i didn't find the level model...
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Re: [SA2B] "All" the Unused Models

Post by Speeps »

Yeah, the only thing left of SONIC TEST and KNUCKLES TEST is their textures.
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