How many chao are there?

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Crazo3077
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Crazo3077 »

I have yet to see it as a permanent mouth.
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Yoshichao4 »

Why would it not be a permanent mouth? I have a Chao who was born with that mouth, and he still has it. If you are thinking I'm referring to when the Chao get that mouth from being abused, making them dizzy, then you are mistaken. I'm talking about when Chao are naturally born with it.
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Gamer_Chao007 »

Thats alot of chao!
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Echo2VX »

so there are actually only a little less than 1 tillion? i think im gonna try to work this out myself as well.
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Mamkute »

Should the fact that an invisible chao's eye lids are, like the rest of their body, invisible? I mean, a dark invisible chao will have the evil eyes, but the eye lids are nowhere to be found, thus cutting out the tired eyes and others from non-dark invisible chao. I don't want to sound like a jerk, asking people to do more math, I am just asking for the sake of making the list as accurate as possible.
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Tayrtahn »

If you really want to go crazy, you could count every single second evolution slider variant separately.
Fusion wrote:There are 41 different second evolution values for each slider: 20 values above 0, 20 values below 0, and 0 (the neutral position). This means there are 41x41=1681 different second evolution combinations for each first evolution.

For a child chao's gradual evolution, there would be 21x21=441 different combinations (without counting alignment).
...so, with 1681 different second evolutions for each of the 5 first evolutions (ignoring alignment), there are 8405 possible second evolutions. Mind you, the changes between steps are pretty subtle, so they're not all hugely "different". But they're not quite the same either!

And that's not taking into account the Evolution Strength variable, which makes chao slowly change during each stage of their life. Every different value of that variable also results in a slightly different chao, which is why second evolutions gradually appear. Factor that in, and you have an absurd number of chao varieties even without skin color, headgear, facial features, and the like!
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Mamkute »

^Yep, in fact, I was going to put that math up, but you beat me to it. However, if we count every slider point for the second evolution, we might as well do so for the first gradual evolution. Which, assuming I can still do math, has 18081( counting both stat sliders and the alignment slider.) Once again, this does not include the gradual strength slider, which would make things many more times difficult.
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by healthways001 »

I think 2
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Crash32 »

Crazo3077 wrote:Thank you for pointing that out, Echo2VX.

To make a few corrections:

There are 159 Body Types.

There are 1854 Forms a Chao can take based on Body and Face. (I do not accept the squiggly mouth as an obtainable permanent mouth.)

There are 52 Headgear Options. (I added the 11 Jewel Eggshells)

To determine the total to include headgear one needs to take the Body total, multiply it by the Headgear Options, then add the Body and Face total. This creates a total of 10122 Forms of Chao using Body, Face, and Headgear.

There are 77 Skin Colors.

There is a total of 779,394 Forms of Chao using Body, Face, Headgear, and Skin.

Then if we include the Sonic Adventure Animal Parts there is a total of 984,842,258,400 Kinds of Chao based on Body, Faces, Headgear, Skin, and Animal Parts.

This should be more accurate.
And you are sure about that? That doesn't sound right. How can there be 9 Trillion Chao?

But if it is right...
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Echo2VX »

@ Crash32:
thats is 9 billion...not trillion, but near 1 trillion
@entire topic:
what if we counted the stats changes as well? meaning every combination of stats...each stat can go up to 3266. so...
984,842,258,400 x (3266 x 5) = 1.60824741 × 16,082,474,079,672,000 (16 quadrillion, 82 trillion, 474 billion, 79 million, 672 thousand)
its almost to much for a normal calculator to handle...even online. this is very inaccurate, but im not wasting time right now and im actually planning on talking to a mathematition to solve it for us with and without stats :D

EDIT:
just re-did all math and came up with 163,919,186,944 not counting stats
counting stats: 2,709,460,322,795,520 (almost 3 quadrillion)
counting stats and hacked chao such as omochao and animals: 70,445,968,392,683,520 as my final sum. more than 70 quadrillion and close to 1 quintillion. more then the entire economic count of the world! then again this is EXTREMELY inaccurate and could possible be of by an entire 3 or 6 zeros
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Jeffery Mewtamer »

Echo2VX wrote:(3266 x 5)
That should be 3266 ^ 5 or approximately 3.72E17. This is of course assuming that a stat value of 1 is possible without hacking. Also, hacking raises the stat limit to 4000, raising this part of the huge calculation to exactly 1.024E18. Of course, if we are going to expand into non-visible characteristics like stats, we also need to expand from the 77 phenotypical breeds to the full 600+ genotypical breeds.

Also, here the real mind blowing thing: Despite all the possible variation with Chao, they are still far simpler and less varied than the vast majority of real life organisms.
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Cool Chao »

Crazo3077 wrote:Well everything needs to be pointed out clearly to figure this out.

If there is the Baby Form, Five First Evolutions, Twenty-Five Second Evolutions, Twenty Mixed Second Evolutions, and the Chaos Form that makes Fifty-Two Types. Then factoring in the fact that there are Three Alignments (Neutral, Hero, and Dark) that takes the number up to 156. Next add the Character Chao and that makes 159 forms Chao can take at different time in their life.

Then comes breeds. If there are Fourteen Colors (White, Grey, Black, Pink, Red, Orange, Yellow, Lime Green, Green, Sky Blue, Blue, Purple, Brown, and Normal), Two Tones (Mono-Tone and Two-Tone), Twelve Jewel Coats (Lack of Coat, Silver, Gold, Ruby, Sapphire, Amethyst, Emerald, Garnet, Aquamarine, Peridot, Topaz, and Onyx), and Two Options for Shininess (Non-Shiny and Shiny) that means there are 673 Genotypical Breeds, but since many of them look the same, there are only Seventy-Seven Phenotypical Breeds.

This results in 12,012 kinds of Chao based on Body and Skin.


As for headgear, there is the Twenty-Seven Eggshells (Thirteen Colors, Thirteen Shiny Color, and Normal), the Two Garden Headgear (Pumpkin and Skull), and the Twelve Black Market Headgear (Apple, Box, Pan, Can, Bag, Tree, Bucket, Pot, Watermelon, and Three Wool Hats) there are Forty-One Headgear Options.

Now the total is 492,492 kinds of Chao based on Body, Skin, and Headgear.

I don't have specific numbers on animal parts and medals so this is as far as I can go. If someone can help make a list of each option for each body part that would help finish this list up.


Thanks to Fusion I have a list of animal parts for Sonic Adventure.

With Twelve Arms, Eight Ears, Fourteen Feet, Five Forehead Decals, One Horns Option, Fourteen Tails, and Three Wings and adding one to each group for a lack there of a body part gives us 1,263,600 possible animal part combinations.

So on Sonic Adventure Deluxe we have 622,312,891,200 kinds of Chao based on Body, Skin, Headgear, and Animal Parts.
WOAH! THats alot of combos! No one would even LIVE to make all of them. Good research Crazo
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Crash32 »

Echo2VX wrote:@ Crash32:
thats is 9 billion...not trillion, but near 1 trillion
@entire topic:
what if we counted the stats changes as well? meaning every combination of stats...each stat can go up to 3266. so...
984,842,258,400 x (3266 x 5) = 1.60824741 × 16,082,474,079,672,000 (16 quadrillion, 82 trillion, 474 billion, 79 million, 672 thousand)
its almost to much for a normal calculator to handle...even online. this is very inaccurate, but im not wasting time right now and im actually planning on talking to a mathematition to solve it for us with and without stats :D

EDIT:
just re-did all math and came up with 163,919,186,944 not counting stats
counting stats: 2,709,460,322,795,520 (almost 3 quadrillion)
counting stats and hacked chao such as omochao and animals: 70,445,968,392,683,520 as my final sum. more than 70 quadrillion and close to 1 quintillion. more then the entire economic count of the world! then again this is EXTREMELY inaccurate and could possible be of by an entire 3 or 6 zeros
That's embarrassing :/

And I've never even heard of quintillion!
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Echo2VX »

@Crash32
at least we arent dealing with things such as quattuordecillion, vigintillion, and centillion which is bigger than a googol. then you would be in trouble crash XD. besides, i dont think they even make calculators to handle numbers that big O_O and im pretty sure everyone would be in trouble if we were dealing with things such as a quinquagintaquadringentilliard in which you would have to multiply earths weight in lbs by 207 in order to get near...thank god for the small amount of trillions :chaohappy:
@ Topic
I have a great idea! why dont we just ask the programmers/sega about it!? im pretty sure they have the exact info all down somewhere in their database...im gonna try to get ahold of them :P
Last edited by Echo2VX on Fri Jul 31, 2015 2:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by iSystemChaos »

@Echo
Good idea. :D
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Jeffery Mewtamer »

Echo2VX wrote:Why don't we just ask the programmers/Sega about it? I'm pretty sure they have the exact info all down somewhere in their database.
Assuming you could actually get an interview with some of the original Chao programmers and that they were at liberty to answer our questions, there is a good chance that they themselves remember little of what was actually coded.

Besides, they did not explicitly program trillions of unique Chao. These huge numbers simply arise as one considers the range for each individual variable(skin color, evolution, hat, mouth, animal parts, etc) and multiplying them together.

As for big numbers: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Names_of_large_numbers
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by CustardChao »

the only the i can say is....................................................................................................................................... i have no idea. :darkno: :no:
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by LightTheChao »

Its googolplex, 1 with goolgol zeroes behind it, so like an exact infinite number. (I dunno i just know that there's ALOT of differnt chao)
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Echo2VX »

lol, a googleplex isnt infinate! there just isnt enough room in the universe to fit it, even if it were written out in 1 point font :P
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by ChaosDragon »

All I can say is
Everyone who attemps these maths is a freaking genius :darkhappy:
meh no lik da maths :darkno:
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by MoonMintFox »

Oh wow. O_O
That's a hell of a lot of chao. X.x;
Also, I have a chao with a permanent squiggly mouth, Crazo. :o
I'll get a picture.
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Crazo3077 »

I should probably have said this before and I don't even know if Echo2VX is still around, but as far as any of us can tell Sega gave up on Chao so the likelihood of us getting a direct answer out of them is highly unlikely. The best you're going to get is what me, Fusion, and any other person who has hacked any of these Chao Gardens can drum up based on the programming. But keep in mind that just because it is in the programming doesn't mean it is possible without hacking. The answer to "How many Chao are there?" would have to be cut into multiple sections, the biggest division being without hacking and with hacking. With hacking there are tons of new variables that could be introduced and found to cause more questions than reveal more answers. Its better for everyone to stick with what you can do without hacking.
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Re: How many chao are there?

Post by Echo2VX »

still around and still working with the problem...i actually had one of my trigonometry teachers try it out...he couldn't figure it it out either...therefore, i now officially give up (for now). :no:
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